* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [00:00:07] HERE WE GO. WE, I NOW CALL TO ORDER THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING FOR NOVEMBER 20TH, 2025. UH, MS. PARKER, DO WE HAVE A QUORUM? YES, MS. KOWALSKI, WE HAVE A QUORUM. UM, I INVITE YOU TO PLEASE STAND FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE, FOLLOWED BY THE INVOCATION, BY MR. PATEK [1. Call To Order] [2. Pledge of Allegiance] PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO REPUBLIC, REPUBLIC FOR WHICH STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, [3. Invocation - Led By Mr. Pituck] WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. MOST GRACIOUS GOD, THANK YOU FOR ENABLING US TO GATHER HERE TODAY. THANK YOU FOR THIS BODY OF PEOPLE THAT YOU HAVE REDEEMED TO RULE THIS GREAT COUNTY. NOW, AS WE GO ABOUT DOING THE BUSINESS SET FORTH TODAY, HELP US TO KEEP YOU FIRST IN EVERYTHING THAT WE SAY AND DO, BLESS ALL WHO ARE AUTHORITY WITH THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE, WISDOM, AND UNDERSTANDING, SO THAT WE MAY PROSPER UNDER THEIR LEADERSHIP. MOST OF ALL, BIN US TOGETHER IN A SPIRIT OF LOVE, WHICH SURPASSES ALL THINGS IS IN YOUR OMNIPOTENT NAME WE PRAY. AMEN. UM, HAS EVERYONE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO READ THE MINUTES FROM THE OCTOBER 16TH, 2025 MEETING? UM, OR THERE ANY COMMENTS, UH, CORRECTIONS, OR IS THERE A MOTION TO APPROVE? [4. Approval of Minutes] MADAM CHAIR, RID AND I, UH, MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE. IS THERE A SECOND? I SECOND. I'LL ROLL CALL PLEASE. ? YES, MA'AM. MR. KIMBERLY? AYE. MR. PATEK AYE. MS. KOWALSKI? AYE. MR. MCLAUGHLIN? AYE. MR. DEAN, I'LL ABSTAIN. THANK YOU. UM, I NOW HAVE THE PLEASURE OF INTRODUCING OUR NEW PLANNING COMMISSIONER MEMBER, UM, MARTIN DEAN. UM, I HAVE A LITTLE BIO HERE THAT I WILL, UM, KIND OF GO OVER HERE. UM, HE HAS BEEN MARRIED TO KATHY DEAN FOR 41 WONDERFUL YEARS. UM, AND I LIKE THAT THEY ARE PATIENTLY WAITING FOR GRANDCHILDREN. THAT WAS MY FAVORITE PART, BUT HAS BEEN A RESIDENT OF GLAND COUNTY FOR 11 YEARS AND IS IN DISTRICT FIVE. UM, UH, HAS A LOT OF EXPERIENCE IN THE GLAND FIRE AND RESCUE. UM, VOLUNTEER CAPTAIN WITH STATION NUMBER ONE AND, UH, HAS, UH, OVERSEEN THE RESERVATION RENOVATION OF THREE DISTRICTS, UH, FIRE STATIONS, UH, ONE, THREE, AND FIVE. UM, AND SERVED IN THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR ROLE. SO, UM, I THINK I SPEAK FOR ALL OF US WHEN WE SAY WELCOME. THANK YOU FOR, UM, ALL THAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND, UM, YES, WELCOME, WELCOME, WELCOME. ALL RIGHT. UH, WE ARE NOW READY FOR THE DIRECTOR'S REPORT FROM MS. SHERRY. [5. Director's Report / Announcements] GOOD EVENING. UH, MADAM CHAIR, MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION. UH, WELCOME MR. DEAN. TODAY'S UPDATE, I WILL BE INFORMING THE COMMISSION AND THE AUDIENCE OF UPCOMING PLANNING AND ZONING RELATED PUBLIC HEARINGS AND SCHEDULED COMMUNITY MEETINGS FOR PLANNING AND ZONING PRE-APPLICATION. THESE MEETINGS ARE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC, AND THE PUBLIC IS ENCOURAGED TO ATTEND AND PARTICIPATE. UM, IT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT THE PUBLIC HEARINGS I'M GONNA BE DISCUSSING TONIGHT AND ALL PUBLIC HEARINGS, THOSE ARE LIVE STREAMED, SO ANYONE WHO IS UNABLE TO MAKE THE MEETING CAN WATCH IT LIVE FROM ANOTHER LOCATION OR THEY CAN GO BACK TO THE WEBSITE AND, UM, WATCH IT, UH, UH, AFTER THE MEETING BECAUSE THEY ARE RECORDED AND POSTED ON THE WEBSITE. SO, I'M GOING TO NOW TELL YOU ABOUT THE PUBLIC HEARINGS THAT WILL BE HELD AT THE DECEMBER 2ND, 2025 BOARD OF SUPERVISORS MEETING. THERE IS AN APPLICATION IN DISTRICT ONE, UM, STAFF IS ACTUALLY REQUESTING A DEFERRAL OF THIS APPLICATION. THE APPLICATION IS BY PAUL BUSH. HE IS REQUESTING A RENEWAL OF A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A MINING OPERATION THAT'S LOCATED ON SHANNON HILL. STAFF IS, UM, REQUESTING THIS, UM, DEFERRAL BECAUSE WE WANT TO WORK WITH THE APPLICANT. UH, WE HAVE SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THE ACCESS TO THE PROPERTY, SO WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THEY ARE CORRECT BEFORE WE MOVE FORWARD. UM, IN DISTRICT FOUR, UH, THERE IS AN APPLICATION BY ENTERPRISE LEASING COMPANY OF NORFOLK AND RICHMOND, LLC. THEY'RE REQUESTING TO RENEW AN EXISTING CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT TO ALLOW FOR AUTOMOBILE RENTAL. IT'S A BUSINESS THAT HAS, UH, BEEN, UM, IN GLAND COUNTY FOR THE LAST FIVE YEARS. IT'S LOCATED IN THE BROADVIEW SHOPPING CENTER. UH, THEY ARE PROPOSING NO CHANGES [00:05:01] TO THEIR APPLICATION. QUESTION DID, I THOUGHT WE APPROVED THIS. UM, THERE WAS AN APPROVAL. UH, ARE YOU, ARE YOU REFERENCING THE PAUL BUSH? NO. OH, WHICH ONE? SORRY. ENTERPRISE. THIS IS FOR THE BOARD. THIS IS FOR THE BOARD RIVER. I'M SORRY. OKAY. , MY APOLOGIES. NO PROBLEM. NO PROBLEM. YEAH. OH, IT'S, UM, IT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS MEETING WILL BE HELD ON THE SECOND HERE IN THE BOARDROOM, WHICH IS 1800. SANDY HOOK ROAD IS THE ADDRESS TO THE ADMIN BUILDING, AND THE MEETING IS AT SIX O'CLOCK. OH, THERE ACTUALLY, I'M, I'M, UH, READ THAT PREMATURELY. THERE ARE TWO MORE APPLICATIONS. THERE ARE ACTUALLY COMPANION CASES THAT WILL BE HELD. UM, THE APPLICANT IS GRAHAM REAL ESTATE, LLC. UM, THEY'RE PROPOSING A SELF STORAGE MINI WAREHOUSE FACILITY. UH, THE PROPERTY FOR THIS PROPOSED FACILITY IS LOCATED JUST EAST OF TUCKAHOE PINES RETIREMENT COMMUNITY, WHICH IS LOCATED AT 12 3 30 PATTERSON AVENUE. UM, SO THEY'RE HAVING TWO APPLICATIONS. THE FIRST APPLICATION FOR THIS REQUEST IS A PROFFER AMENDMENT. A PROFFER AMENDMENT IS NECESSARY BECAUSE THE ORIGINAL ZONING OF THE PROPERTY DID NOT ALLOW FOR A USE OF SELF STORAGE MINI WAREHOUSE. SO THEY ARE ADDING, REQUESTING TO HAVE THAT ADDED AS A, UM, ALLOWED USE. THEY'RE ALSO GOING TO BE, UM, REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR THE MINI WAREHOUSE STORAGE, BECAUSE IN THE B ONE ZONING DISTRICT, IT IS A REQUIREMENT TO HAVE A CEP TO OPERATE. OKAY. SO NOW MOVING ON TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION. ON DECEMBER 18TH, THE PLANNING COMMISSION WILL HOLD TWO PUBLIC HEARINGS. UM, IN DISTRICT ONE, THERE'S AN APPLICATION BY JOSEPH LILLY REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR AN ACCESSORY FAMILY HOUSING UNIT DETACH. AND THIS IS LOCATED AT 5 2 5 9 LOVING SPRING LANE. IN DISTRICT THREE, UH, THERE IS AN APPLICATION BY TERRY BRYAN REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR ANOTHER FAMILY, UH, ASSIST ACCESSORY FAMILY HOUSING UNIT. DETACHED IN LOCATION FOR THIS REQUEST IS, UH, 2050 HAWK TOWN ROAD. UM, THESE PUBLIC HEARINGS WILL BE ON DECEMBER 18TH, ALSO IN THE BOARD ROOM, UM, AT SIX O'CLOCK. OKAY. SO NOW MOVING ON TO COMMUNITY MEETINGS. WE HAVE TWO COMMUNITY MEETINGS SCHEDULED AS OF TODAY. UH, THE FIRST COMMUNITY MEETING IS A PRE-APPLICATION IN DISTRICT FOUR. THIS IS A REQUEST BY MAIN STREET HOMES TO REZONE APPROXIMATELY 123 ACRES FROM AGRICULTURAL LIMITED TO RESIDENTIAL LIMITED. UM, THEY'RE PLANNING A, UM, A RESIDENTIAL SUBDIVISION WITH APPROXIMATELY 61 HOMES. AND THE LOCATION OF THIS IS 2161 MANNEQUIN ROAD. THIS MEETING WILL BE HELD ON MONDAY, DECEMBER 1ST AT ST. MATTHEWS UNITED METHODIST CHURCH, WHICH IS LOCATED AT 1706 MATTHEWS LANE, ST. MATTHEWS LANE, EXCUSE ME. AND THIS MEETING WILL BE AT SIX O'CLOCK. AND THE SECOND COMMUNITY MEETING IS FOR A PRE-APPLICATION IN DISTRICT FIVE BY STEVEN AND KAREN DASH. THEY'RE REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE FOR PERMIT FOR AN, CAN YOU, CAN YOU ADVANCE THE SLIDE? OH, THANK YOU. OKAY. I'LL START OVER. SO THIS NEXT COMMUNITY MEETING, THE LAST ONE I'M PRESENTING THIS EVENING IS A PRE-APPLICATION IN DISTRICT FIVE BY STEVEN AND KAREN DASH. THEY'RE REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR AN ACCESSORY FAMILY HOUSING UNIT DETACHED LOCATED AT 1259 MANNEQUIN ROAD. THIS MEETING WILL BE HELD ON MONDAY, DECEMBER 8TH, AND IS AT THE, UM, LOCATION WHERE THE, UM, PROPOSED NEW DWELLING IS, UM, BEING REQUESTED. AND THAT'S AT 1259 MANNEQUIN ROAD. AND THAT MEETING WILL BE AT 6:00 PM AND THAT CONCLUDES MY UPDATE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MS. CHAIR. THANK YOU. [6. Citizen Comment Period] UM, WE WILL NOW ALL MOVE ON TO THE CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD PER THE PLANNING COMMISSION BYLAWS. SECTION FOUR, ADDRESSING THE COMMISSION PUBLIC COMMENTS. GENERALLY, ALL PERSONS WHO WISH, WHO SPEAK BEFORE THE COMMISSION DURING THE CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD OR A PUBLIC HEARING SHALL DO SO FROM THE LECTERN AND FURNISH THEIR NAMES AND ADDRESSES TO THE COMMISSION. A SPEAKER SHALL ONLY SPEAK ONCE ON ANY ITEM UNLESS THE COMMISSION ASKS THE SPEAKER TO ANSWER QUESTIONS. NO PERSON MAY ADDRESS THE COMMISSION UNLESS THEY HAVE FIRST BEEN RECOGNIZED BY THE CHAIR. EACH PERSON WHO DESIRES TO SPEAK SHALL BE GIVEN TIME TO PRESENT ORAL OR WRITTEN COMMENTS. COMMENTS SHALL BE DIRECTED TO THE COMMISSION, NOT TO THE AUDIENCE. CITIZEN COMMENT, PERIOD. THE CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD PROVIDES A PUBLIC FORUM FOR THE COMMISSION TO HEAR FROM CITIZENS ABOUT MATTERS PERTINENT TO THE ACTIVITIES, ISSUES, OR POLICIES OF THE COMMISSION. THE CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD IS LIMITED TO MATTERS THAT ARE NOT SCHEDULED FOR PUBLIC HEARING. ON TONIGHT'S AGENDA, I WILL NOW OPEN THE CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD. IF YOU [00:10:01] WISH TO SPEAK DURING THE CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD, PLEASE COME FORWARD AND STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS. YOU WILL HAVE THREE MINUTES TO SPEAK. THE GREEN LIGHT INDICATES THE START OF YOUR THREE MINUTES. THE YELLOW LIGHT INDICATES THAT YOU HAVE ONE MINUTE REMAINING AND THE RED LIGHT INDICATES THE END OF YOUR TIME. THANK YOU. I HAVE SOMEONE DONATING MINUTES TO ME TODAY. MM-HMM . ANN BRIDGES, UM, SABO HILL. I AM REVEREND LISA SYKES. I LIVE AT 1 2 4 8 2 NORTH CROSSING DRIVE IN READERS BRANCH. GOOD EVENING PLANNING COMMISSION AND CONGRATULATIONS. COMMISSIONER DEAN, I WANNA THANK YOU FOR THE WORK YOU'VE PUT INTO THE TECHNOLOGY OVERLY DISTRICT. I'VE COME TO SPEAK AS AN ALLY, NOT AS AN ADVERSARY. I WANT TO SPEAK BRIEFLY ABOUT WATER AND GROUNDWATER PROTECTION. THE DRAFT TOD ORDINANCE NOW SAYS THAT ANY USE IN THE DISTRICT MUST USE PUBLIC WATER AND SEWER. AND THAT ONSITE REUSE AND TREATMENT OF WATER IS ALLOWED BEFORE IT GOES BACK TO THE PUBLIC SYSTEM. BUT KNOWING 85% OF THE COUNTY IS ON WELL WATER MAKES ME CONCERNED THAT THIS LANGUAGE DOESN'T ACTUALLY PRECLUDE FUTURE GROUNDWATER WITHDRAWALS. I THINK WE NEED TO PAY ATTENTION TO THAT. THE TOD NEVER CLEARLY STATES THAT ALL WATER USED AND REUSED MUST ORIGINATE FROM THE COUNTY'S PUBLIC WATER SYSTEM. IT NEVER CLEARLY PROHIBITS NEW WELLS OR GROUNDWATER EXTRACTION FOR DATA CENTERS OR OTHER INTENSIVE USES IN THE TOD. AND THE WORD REUSE ISN'T DEFINED, WHICH COULD ALLOW SOMEONE IN A FUTURE COUNTY ADMINISTRATION TO ARGUE THAT INDUSTRIES ARE SIMPLY REUSING GROUNDWATER THEY PUMPED FROM AN AQUIFER. THAT'S WHY REGULATING WATER USAGE IN THE TOD BY A PLAN OF DEVELOPMENT IS INSUFFICIENT. I WANNA SAY THAT AGAIN. 'CAUSE I REALLY BELIEVE THAT REGULATING WATER USAGE IN THE TOD BY A PLAN OF DEVELOPMENT IS INSUFFICIENT. IF WE CARE ABOUT PROTECTING OUR AQUIFER, ESPECIALLY FOR GLAND FAMILIES AND FARMS RELYING ON WELLS FOR GENERATIONS TO COME, THEN WE NEED THE ORDINANCE LANGUAGE TO BE AS CLEAR AS THE COUNTY STATED INTENT. CURRENTLY, THE TOD ORDINANCE REQUIRES USES TO CONNECT TO PUBLIC WATER. BUT UNDER VIRGINIA ZONING LAW, THE WORD USE DOES NOT REGULATE THE SOURCE OF WATER. IT ONLY REGULATES THE ACTIVITY ON THE LAND. THIS MEANS THAT COULD LEGALLY CONNECT THEIR DATA CENTER TO PUBLIC WATER TO SATISFY THE ORDINANCE AND STILL THEN DRILL SUPPLEMENTAL GROUNDWATER WELLS IF THE ORDINANCE DOES NOT EXPLICITLY BAN THEM. THIS IS A VULNERABILITY THAT MUST BE ADDRESSED FOR THE GOOD OF GOOCHLAND. SO MY REQUEST TONIGHT IS VERY SIMPLE. SPELL IT OUT CLEARLY THAT ALL WATER AND ALL REUSED WATER FOR THE TOD MUST COME FROM THE PUBLIC WATER SYSTEM TO EXPLICITLY PROHIBIT NEW WELLS OR GROUNDWATER. EXTRACTION FOR INDUSTRIAL PROCESSES ARE COOLING WITHIN THE TOD THREE. DEFINE REUSE. SO IT MEANS RECIRCULATING WATER THAT WAS ORIGINALLY PURCHASED FROM THE PUBLIC WATER SYSTEM, NOT GROUNDWATER PUMPED FROM BENEATH OUR HOUSES. ADDITIONALLY, THESE PROTECTIONS OF GLAND'S, AQUIFER, AND WALL WATER MUST BE INCLUDED IN USE OF STANDARDS FOR DATA CENTERS. SOMETHING REQUIRED BY THE CODE OF VIRGINIA, BUT IT'S CURRENTLY ABSENT IN THE TOD AS IT IS WRITTEN. THESE ARE MODEST COMMON SENSE CHANGES THAT WOULD GIVE RESIDENTS CONFIDENCE THAT THE, I'M SORRY THAT THE TECHNOLOGY OVERLAY DISTRICT TRULY PROTECTS OUR AQUIFER IN THE LONG TERM WHILE STILL ALLOWING THE COUNTY TO PURSUE HIGH QUALITY ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT. THANK YOU FOR CONSIDERING THIS SERIOUS ISSUE AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND YOUR SERVICE TONIGHT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU REVEREND SYKES. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE THAT WOULD LIKE TO COME AND SPEAK ON MATTERS NOT RELATED TO, UH, CASES THIS EVENING? I WILL NOW CLOSE, UH, THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS EVENING. UM, MADAM [7. Unfinished Business - None] CHAIR, IS THERE ANY UNFINISHED BUSINESS? THERE IS NO UNFINISHED BUSINESS. MADAM CLERK , UH, MADAM [8. New Business - None] CLERK, IS THERE ANY NEW BUSINESS? THERE IS NO NEW BUSINESS. ARE THERE ANY REQUESTS TO DEFER OR FOR DEFER ADDITIONS, DELETIONS, OR CHANGES TO THE ORDER OF THE PUBLIC HEARING? WE HAVE RECEIVED A REQUEST [9. Requests to Defer, Additions, Deletions, or Changes to the Order of Public Hearings] FROM THE APPLICANT OF OUR FIRST PUBLIC HEARING ITEM DISTRICT TWO CU 20 25 8 APPLICATION BY 26 40 FAIRGROUND ROAD LLC REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, CUP FOR SHORT-TERM RENTAL, UNHOSTED [1. District 2 - CU-2025-00008 Application by 2640 Fairground Rd, LLC requesting a conditional use permit (CUP) for short-term rental, unhosted on 0.89 acres at 2640 Fairground Road on Tax Map No. 42-8-2-4-0. The property is zoned Agricultural, Limited (A-2). The CUP is required by County Zoning Ordinance Sec. 15-112 in accordance with Sec. 15-285-G. The Comprehensive Plan designates this area as Neighborhood Residential.] ON 0.89 ACRES AT 26 40 FAIRGROUND ROAD ON TAX MAP 42 8 2 4 0. [00:15:01] THE PROPERTY IS ZONED AGRICULTURAL LIMITED A TWO. THE CUP IS REQUIRED BY COUNTY ZONING ORDINANCE SECTION 15 1 12 IN ACCORDANCE WITH SECTION 15,280 5G. AND THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN DESIGNATES THIS AREA AS NEIGHBORHOOD RESIDENTIAL. THE APPLICANT FOR THIS ITEM HAS REQUESTED TO WITHDRAW THEIR APPLICATION. THANK YOU, MS. PARKER. THE COMMISSION ACKNOWLEDGES THE REQUEST TO WITHDRAW THE APPLICATION. [10. Public Hearing Items] UM, CAN WE NOW I HEAR OUR FIRST PUBLIC HEARING ITEM, [2. District 1 - CU-2025-00007 Application by Rogel and Marta Venson requesting a conditional use permit (CUP) for short-term rental, unhosted on 30 acres at 4700 Fleming Road on Tax Map No. 2-1-0-32-0. The property is zoned Agricultural, General (A-1). The CUP is required by County Zoning Ordinance Sec. 15-102 in accordance with Sec. 15-285.G. The Comprehensive Plan designates this area as Rural Enhancement Area.] DISTRICT ONE CU 20 25 7 APPLICATION BY ROGEL AND MARTA VINCENT REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, CUP FOR SHORT-TERM RENTAL UNHOSTED ON 30 ACRES AT 4,700 FLEMING ROAD. ON TAX MAP NUMBER 2 1 0 32 0. THE PROPERTY IS ZONED AGRICULTURAL GENERAL A ONE. THE CUP IS REQUIRED BY COUNTY ZONING ORDINANCE SECTION 15 1 0 2 IN ACCORDANCE WITH SECTION 15 2 80 5G. THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN DESIGNATES THIS AREA AS RURAL ENHANCEMENT AREA. THANK YOU, MS. PARKER. GOOD EVENING, MADAM CHAIRWOMAN, MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION FOR THE RECORD. MY NAME IS BEN ELLIS. I'M A PLANNER WITH THE COUNTY. BEFORE WE USED THE APPLICATION BY BRAUL AND MARTA BENSON, UH, FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, UH, FOR SHORT TERM UNHOSTED RENTAL. UH, THE PROPERTY IS LOCATED ON ABOUT 30 ACRES AT, UH, 4,700 FLEMING ROAD IN DISTRICT ONE. THE MAP ON THE LEFT SHOWS THE PROPERTY OUT, OR SORRY, SHOWS THE GENERAL VICINITY OF THE PROPERTY WITHIN THE COUNTY. THE MAP ON THE RIGHT SHOWS THE PROPERTY OUTLINED IN RED, THE PROPERTY AS WELL. THE, AS THE SURROUNDING PROPERTIES EXHIBIT A RURAL CHARACTER. YOU CAN SEE THAT THE PROPERTY IS ON THE GLAND. LOUISA COUNTY LINE. THE PROPERTY IS ACCESSED BY FLEMING ROAD RIGHT HERE, WHICH IS A PRIVATE ROAD. THE ROAD IS MAINTAINED BY THE SHANNON HILL SUBDIVISION TO WHICH THE SUBJECT PROPERTY DOES NOT BELONG. THE PROPERTY AND THE ADJACENT PROPERTIES ARE ZONED A ONE AGRICULTURAL GENERAL. THE COMPRESSIVE PLAN DESIGNATES THE THIS PROPERTY AND THE SURROUNDING PROPERTIES AS RURAL ENHANCEMENT AREA. THE PROPERTY IS CURRENTLY OCCUPIED BY A SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING WITH RESIDENTIAL ACCESSORY STRUCTURES, INCLUDING A POOL. THE APPLICANT HAS BEEN PREVIOUSLY OPERATING AN UNPERMITTED SHORT-TERM RENTAL ON THE PROPERTY. THE APPLICANT IS VOLUNTARILY COMING INTO COMPLIANCE BY APPLYING FOR THIS CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. A SHORT-TERM RENTAL IS DEFINED IN THE COUNTY CODE AS A DWELLING WHERE A PORTION OF, OR THE ENTIRE DWELLING IS USED FOR SLEEPING OR LODGING FOR TRANSIENT RENTERS, WHICH IS RENTED FOR LESS THAN 30 CONSECUTIVE DAYS. IN EXCHANGE FOR A CHARGE. OCCUPANCY IS LIMITED BY THE NUMBER OF OCCUPANTS ALLOWED BY THE SEPTIC SYSTEM PERMIT BUT CANNOT EXCEED. 10. THE APPLICANT HOSTED A COMMUNITY MEETING ON AUGUST 11TH ON SITE FOUR. CITIZENS ATTENDED WITH TWO. IN OPPOSITION TO THE PROPOSAL, THE APPLICANT EXPLAINED THE PROPOSAL. DISCUSSION INCLUDED, UH, THE TRAFFIC ON FLEMING ROAD, THE MAINTENANCE OF THE ROAD, UH, BEHAVIOR OF THE GUESTS OF THE PROPERTY. UM, WITH THESE DRAFT CONDITIONS, UH, THIS PROPOSAL WOULD BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. UM, STAFF HAS RECOMMENDED OUR STANDARD CONDITIONS FOR THIS USE. UH, FIRST THE USE IS FOR SHORT-TERM RENTAL. UNHOSTED, UH, CONDITION TWO RELATES TO THE MAXIMUM OVERNIGHT OCCUPANCY. OCCUPANCY FOR THIS USE IS BASED ON THE LESSER OF SEPTIC CAPACITY OR 10 PEOPLE PER THE BUILDING CODE. CONDITIONS. THREE AND FOUR RELATE TO PUBLIC SAFETY CONDITIONS. FIVE, SIX AND EIGHT RELATE TO ACTIVITIES ON THE PROPERTY WHEN USED AS A SHORT-TERM RENTAL WHILE CONDITIONS SEVEN REGULATES THE PROPERTY'S CHARACTER. CONDITION NINE REQUIRES THE APPLICANT TO PROVIDE NOTICE TO THE GUEST OF THESE CONDITIONS. FURTHERMORE, IF APPROVED THIS PERMIT WOULD BE VALID FOR A PERIOD OF FIVE YEARS. UH, THE LAST CONDITION IS THE COUNTY'S STANDARD TRANSFER AND LEASE LANGUAGE. FINALLY, I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSION. UM, IN CONDITION NUMBER TWO, I THINK IT WAS TWO. IT SAYS IF THEY, I THEY GUESS UPGRADE THEIR SEPTIC. YES. UM, SO THEY'RE RESTRICTED TO, IS THERE TALK OF DOING THAT? IS THAT, UH, NOT, NO. NOT THAT THE APPLICANT HAS PROPOSED. OKAY. UH, BUT YES. UM, [00:20:01] IT'S STANDARD CONDITION FOR THIS USE THAT, UM, THEY'RE ALWAYS GONNA BE LIMITED IT TO 10, UH, BECAUSE AT 10, UH, IT'S CONSIDERED A HOTEL AND BUILDING CODE AND OTHER STUFF KICK IN. UH, BUT, UH, THEY'RE ALSO ALL LIMITED TO THEIR SEPTIC CAPACITY, BOTH THROUGH THIS CONDITION AND ALSO THROUGH HEALTH DEPARTMENT REGULATIONS. IF THEY DO UPGRADE THE SEPTIC CAPACITY TO HOLD MORE, UH, PEOPLE, THEY COULD, UH, BE ALLOWED TO INCREASE THAT CAPACITY, BUT NOT OVER 10 PEOPLE. AND WOULD THAT CHANGE THE CUP AT ALL OR IS THAT PRETTY UPGRADED? THAT WE NEED C THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD COME WITH THIS CONDITION THAT WOULD COME WITH IT. UM, THEY'D STILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT TO GET A NEW SEPTIC, UH, PERMIT AND, UM, GET THAT APPROVED. BUT, BUT THE CURRENT LIMITATION IN THIS CDP IS SIX OVERNIGHT GUESTS? YES, IT IS. BECAUSE IT'S THE LESSER OF TWO. YES. RIGHT. OKAY. HAVE THERE BEEN ANY COMPLAINTS FROM THE PROPERTY OWNERS ADJACENT OR FROM THE COUNTY? UM, TWO CITIZENS AT THE COMMUNITY MEETING DID, UH, HAVE SOME COMPLAINTS OF THE PROPOSAL. UM, BUT DO YOU KNOW WHAT IT WAS IN REGARDS TO, UM, THE TRAFFIC ON THE ROAD? UH, PEOPLE SPEEDING ALONG THE ROAD, UM, IN THE WEAR AND TEAR OF THE ROAD, UM, AND THE BEHAVIOR OF THE GUESTS OF THE PROPERTY. UM, STAFF HAS NOT RECEIVED ANY, UH, OTHER COMPLAINTS OR, UM, CONCERNS ABOUT THIS. OKAY, THANK YOU. SO THAT WAS JUST AT THE COMMUNITY MEETING. THERE'S BEEN NO SENT IN OR FORMAL COMPLAINTS? NOT THAT I'M AWARE OF. OKAY. THANKS. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? MM-HMM. OKAY. THANK YOU. YEP. UH, WOULD THE APPLICANT LIKE TO SPEAK ? HI. HI, I'M ROGEL. COME ON UP. YOU DON'T BITE . I'M SORRY. UM, I'M ELLE VINCENT. OKAY. UH, I LIVE IN 3 7 5 SOUNDBAR LANE. OKAY. MANNEQUIN. UM, THE REASON I LIKE TO RENT ON SHORT TERM IS BECAUSE MY FAMILY ALSO CAN ENJOY THAT THE HOUSE, UH, YOU KNOW, IT'S A SWIMMING POOL. I LIKE TO GO WITH MY GRANDKIDS AND, AND ENJOY THE PROPERTY AS WELL. UM, I'M NOT PLANNING TO HAVE ANY MORE THAN SIX PEOPLE THERE. IT IS ONLY, YOU KNOW, THREE BEDS. SO YOU CANNOT HAVE MORE THAN SIX. JUST, OKAY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU SO MUCH. REAL QUICK, ANY QUESTIONS? REAL BEFORE, YEAH, BEFORE YOU SIT DOWN, DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY RENTERS YOU HAD LAST YEAR? HOW MANY STAYS? NOT A LOT. I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY, BUT IT'S, WE DON'T RENT THAT MUCH. YEAH. JUST A ROUNDABOUT NUMBER. UM, WHEN COVID, WHEN THE COVID START, I HAVE MORE PEOPLE. MM-HMM . BECAUSE OF COVID. AND AFTER THE COVID? UM, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE ONCE A MONTH. MAYBE NOT ON 12, MAYBE? YES SIR. OKAY. YES, SIR. AND DO YOU, DO YOU KNOW WHY YOUR NEIGHBORS WERE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GUEST BEHAVIOR? DO YOU KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT? OR IS THAT, SO WE HAVE A ISSUE ON THE ROAD THAT EVERY, A LOT OF PEOPLE SPEED THERE AND I'M AWARE OF THAT. UM, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO ABOUT THAT ISSUE. UM, AND HE ALSO SAY THAT PEOPLE ARE THERE WITH FOUR WHEELERS. I TOLD HIM I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH IT. YOU KNOW, I CAN'T CONTROL ANYBODY. I CAN'T CONTROL MY SPEED IN MY CAR, BUT NOT ANYBODY ELSE. UM, AND, UM, I UNDERSTAND THAT THAT IS PROBLEM TO KEEP THE ROAD FIXED. WE, WE DID IT MANY TIMES. WE HELPED TO FIX THE ROAD OURSELVES. SO THERE IS A ISSUE THAT, UM, HOPEFULLY THE NEIGHBORHOOD WILL WORK TOGETHER TO KEEP THE ROAD, YOU KNOW, BAD SHAPE AS POSSIBLE. AND I TOLD HIM I'M WILLING TO COME TO THE COUNTY AND, AND SEE WHERE WE CAN WORK WITH THE COUNTY TO, TO TAKE CARE OF THAT TOO. BUT THAT'S ALL I KNOW. ALRIGHT. BUT YOU DON'T KNOW WHEN THE NEIGHBORS SAY THAT SOME OF THE GUESTS HAVE HAD, HAVE EXHIBITED BAD BEHAVIOR. YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT IS OTHER THAN FOUR WHEELERS? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE THINKING? YES, SIR. AND I, I DON'T KNOW WHO THE GAS WAS AND YOU KNOW, WHEN I RENTED, I, I DON'T KNOW WHO WAS COMING. YOU KNOW, THEY PAY ON THE APPLICATION AND, AND IT'S PRIVATE. SO, UM, I HAVE CAMERAS ON THE PROPERTY, BUT OUTSIDE OF THE HOUSE, YOU KNOW, NOT AN INSIDE, BUT IN, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE MIDDLE OF 30 ACRES. SO, UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S FAR FROM EVERYBODY ELSE. OKAY. THANK YOU. YES, SIR. OKAY. ANYBODY ELSE? ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? OKAY, THANK YOU. OKAY. UM, I WILL NOW OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. UM, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO COME FORWARD AND SPEAK ON THIS CASE. UM, YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES TO DO SO. THE GREEN LIGHT INDICATES THE START OF YOUR THREE MINUTES. THE YELLOW LIGHT INDICATES THAT YOU HAVE ONE MINUTE REMAINING AND THE RED LIGHT INDICATES THAT THE END OF YOUR TIME. [00:25:01] MY NAME IS MARVIN BEARD. I LIVE AT 52 93 LONG LANE, LOUISA, VIRGINIA. UH, THE ROAD IS OFF OF FLEMING. AS WE WERE JUST DISCUSSING. UH, I HAVE A SIGNED PETITION BY SOME OF THE RESIDENTS IN THERE. I WAS ABLE TO GET WITH, UH, ON A SATURDAY, WHICH IS HARD TO GET WITH SOME PEOPLE. AND THEN I NEVER BOTHERED THE REST OF THE WEEK BECAUSE OF WORK. BUT I DO HAVE PETITION THAT'S AGAINST THIS AIRBNB. UM, THE CONCERNS IS THE ROAD IS ONE I'VE OBSERVED UNDERAGE DRINKING DOWN THERE, UH, KIDS DRIVING ON THE ROAD, SPINNING DONUTS ON THE DIRT ROAD. AND THE LITTLE, UH, WITH A, HIS ROAD GOES STRAIGHT. MY ROAD MAKES A RIGHT RIGHT THERE. THEY'LL GET UP THERE AND SPIN AROUND IN THEIR CARS SPEED DOWN THE ROAD. UH, WE HAVE A FIELD UP THERE. IT IS COMING DOWN FLEMING ROAD. IT'S ON THE LEFT. IT'S OWNED BY AN INDIVIDUAL THAT ACTUALLY OWNED THE PROPERTY AT ONE TIME DOWN THROUGH THERE. AND, UM, THEY HUNTERS HUNT UP IN THIS PROPERTY. THEY GO UP THERE WHEN THE FOUR WHEELERS, THEY TEAR THE FIELD UP. THEY RIDE. LIKE I SAID, HE CAN'T CONTROL THIS. THE ROAD IS A PRIVATE ROAD. WE ARE HAVING TROUBLE KEEPING THE POTHOLES OUT OF IT. 'CAUSE SOME GET BIG ENOUGH YOU CAN PUT A TANK IN ALMOST. UH, WE'VE, I'VE COME TO GOSEN, SO HIM GOING TO GOOSE AND ABOUT TRYING TO GET IT PAVED OR WHATEVER, IT'S NOT GONNA WORK BECAUSE IT'S TOO MUCH. THEY WANT THE ROAD BROUGHT UP STANDARDS. THAT'S A LOT OF MONEY. UH, THE ASSOCIATION, WE DO WHAT WE CAN WITH IT, YOU KNOW, UH, WE $300 A YEAR. AND LIKE I SAID, IT IS A PRIVATE ROAD. UM, SAFETY'S A CONCERN. UH, YOU HAVE UNFAMILIAR PEOPLE DOWN THERE. LIKE I SAID, THIS IS A PRIVATE ROAD THAT GOES TO HIS PROPERTY. HE HAS ACCESS TO HIS PROPERTY THROUGH THE ROAD. BUT AS FAR AS ANY ASSOCIATION, UH, RESPONSES, HE DON'T HAVE ANY OF THOSE. WHEN THAT PROPERTY WAS DEALT, THE PEOPLE THAT LIVED IN IT ORIGINALLY WAS A FAMILY OF THE OWNER. AND THAT PIECE GOT EXCLUDED OUT OF THE ASSOCIATION. UH, THEY HAD THE ROAD RIGHTS, UM, NOISE NUISANCE. UH, I THINK Y'ALL COME UP WITH NUMBER EIGHT, UH, GUNFIRE AND STUFF. YEAH, IT'S HAPPENED DOWN THERE. UM, YOU KNOW, WE WORRY ABOUT OUR STUFF. I MEAN, YOU GOT PEOPLE COMING IN, YOU KNOW, THAT DON'T BELONG THERE. THEY SEE SOMETHING THEY WANNA STEAL, THEY GET IT AND GO, YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? THEY DON'T HAVE ANY WAY TO CONTROL IT. SO WITH THAT BEING SAID, I DON'T REALLY THINK THAT'S A GOOD THING TO HAVE DOWN THERE. IT'S IN AND OUT, IN AND OUT. PEOPLE DON'T CARE. LIKE HE EVEN SAID HIS OWN PEOPLE, HE CAN'T CONTROL HIS OWN STAFF. THEY GO DOWN THERE AND GET THE EQUIPMENT THERE AND COME OUT THE ROAD FROM SPEEDING. HOW'S HE CAN MAINTAIN ANYTHING ELSE, YOU KNOW? SO DO I, DO Y'ALL WANT THIS PETITION? I'D, I'D LIKE TO SEE IT IF IT, I MEAN, CAN WE DO THAT? OKAY. YEAH. AND WHAT CAN YOU TELL ME ABOUT THE, UH, THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE SIGNED IT? THESE PEOPLE, THEY LIVE THERE. WHY DON'T YOU PUT IT ON THE MICROPHONE? I'M SORRY. YEAH. UM, YEAH, THOSE PEOPLE THAT THEY LIVE THERE, THEY'RE QUIET. THEY, YOU KNOW, THEY DON'T WANT THE, THE TRAFFIC. THEY HAVE KIDS THAT WALK RIDE BICYCLES DOWN THE ROAD. SO NOW, NOW NOT ALL OF THESE ARE ON FLEMING ROAD, SO NO, THEY'RE, BUT SEE WHAT I'M SAYING IS, IS, IS FLEMING ROAD IS THE MAIN ACCESS TO MY ROAD AND TO WOODSTONE COURT. OKAY. SO WITH THAT MAIN ROAD GETTING TORE UP ALL THE WAY DOWN THERE WITH POTHOLES, WE STILL HAVE TO FACE THAT ROAD TO GET TO OUR HOUSES. ALRIGHT. AND YOU PAY, YOU SAY $300 A YEAR TOWARDS THE MAINTENANCE RIGHT. OF, OF THAT ROAD DOES. RIGHT. AND, AND THAT, DOES HE PAY THAT AS WELL? HUH? DOES HE PAY THAT AS WELL? NO, SIR. OKAY. HE IS, HIS PROPERTY, LIKE I SAID, GOT EXCLUDED OUT OF THE ASSOCIATION BECAUSE IT WAS LIKE MR. FLEMING SAY HE OWNED ALL PROPERTY OUT THERE, THERE, SO HE HAD THE BIG FARMHOUSE IN THE FIELD AND THIS WAS A FARMHOUSE THAT WAS IN THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY THAT HIS FAMILY OWNED IS MY UNDERSTANDING IS HOW IT WENT. SO THEREFORE, WHEN THEY DIVIDED IT UP AND MADE THE DISSOCIATION THROUGH THERE, THERE'S PART OF THE, UH, FLEMING THAT'S NOT IN THE ASSOCIATION, THEN THE ASSOCIATION STARTS AND THEN HE LIVES AT THE VERY END OF FLEMING. RIGHT, RIGHT. GOT IT. OKAY. SO, AND I HAVE HAD, UM, THE COUNTY COME OUT THERE AND LOOK AT PAVING THE ROAD. WE'VE HAD MEETINGS BEFORE AND IT'S, IT'S A NO GO. OKAY. THANKS. OKAY, THANK YOU. WOULD ANYONE, SORRY, WOULD ANYONE ELSE CARE TO SPEAK? UH, WOULD THE APPLICANT LIKE TO COME UP, UH, FOR A REBUTTAL? I JUST WANNA SAY THAT I WANNA BE A GOOD NEIGHBOR. YOU KNOW, IF ANYTHING THAT I CAN HELP WITH THIS ROAD AS I DID IT BEFORE, I'LL BE HAPPY TO HELP TO PUT STONES THERE. I LEARNED THAT I DON'T NEED TO PAY FOR WHEN I BOUGHT THE PROPERTY. RIGHT. BECAUSE THEY HAVE THEIR OWN AGREEMENT, BUT I'M [00:30:01] MORE THAN WILLING TO WORK WITH THEM, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER I CAN, WHATEVER, YOU KNOW. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. CAN YOU COME BACK FOR JUST A MOMENT? HOW, HOW LONG HAVE YOU BEEN RENTING, UH, WITHOUT THE APPROVAL? UH, HOW LONG HAS IT BEEN USED AS A SHORTTERM RENTAL? WE STARTED, UH, AT ABOUT WHEN COVID. OKAY. SO 2020. SO FIVE YEARS OR SO? YES, SIR. ALRIGHT. IF WE APPROVE THIS TONIGHT, IT WILL ONLY BE FOR FIVE YEARS. AND IF THERE ARE THE, THE FIRST THING WE ASK IN A, IN A RE-APPROVAL IS, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S THE EXPERIENCE BEEN FOR THE, IT'S BEEN AWESOME. NO, SO, SO WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT ARE CONCERNED ABOUT HOW IT'S BEEN GOING FOR THE LAST FIVE YEARS. UM, THAT'S USUALLY A, I DON'T KNOW, KIND OF A RED FLAG FOR ME, BUT THANK YOU. YES, SIR. UM, I ALSO SH YOU KNOW, WE CAN'T HELP THE LOCATION, BUT THE FACT THAT THEY'RE COMING THROUGH A, A PRIVATE ROAD WHERE HOAS PAY, UM, AND THEN THEY'RE AT THAT END OF THAT ROAD WHERE THEN THEY DON'T HAVE, THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED TO. AND YES, A A HANDSHAKE'S GREAT AND WE ARE GOING TO HELP. BUT IF THERE'S NO ACTUAL REQUIREMENT, I HAVE A CONCERN WITH, UM, THE ACCESS TO THE END OF THAT PRIVATE ROAD, UM, FOR THIS, IF THERE HAVE BEEN, YOU KNOW, IT, IT DOES SEEM THAT THERE ARE CITIZENS ON THAT ROAD THAT ARE PAYING TO MAINTAIN IT, THAT DO HAVE CONCERNS. RIGHT. ARE, ARE, SO, IS THE, THE PUBLIC COMMENT CLOSED? DO WE CLOSE THIS? IS THERE ANYONE ELSE THAT WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK? WE'LL NOW CLOSE THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD. MY APOLOGIES. CAN, CAN WE, I'LL ASK THE, OUR, OUR ATTORNEY, CAN WE REQUEST A PROFFER ON THIS? THAT IS, THAT, IS THAT OUT OF LINE FOR SOMETHING LIKE THIS? A PROFFER OF, OF LIKE SOME SORT OF AGREEMENT FOR MAINTENANCE ON THE ROAD? IT IS, IT IS OUT OF LINE. OKAY. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT. THE, THE SPEAKER MENTIONED THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS PEOPLE DOING WHATEVER YOU CALL 'EM, UH, BURNOUTS, I GUESS AND YEAH. PLAYING OR JUST WHAT? JUST MAKING MISCHIEF DRINKING BEER AND STUFF. YES, SIR. DO YOU CAN'T CORRELATE THAT WITH HIS GUESTS SPECIFICALLY, CAN YOU? YES, SIR. I CAUGHT THEM DOING IT AND I WENT DOWN TO THE HOUSE AND TOLD 'EM THAT IT'S NOT ALLOWED ON THE RED THERE. YEAH. AND THAT'S WHEN THEY WERE THE YOUNG 18, 19 YEAR OLDS THAT WAS DRINKING DOWN THERE. THAT'S THE ONES I WAS REFERRING TO, THE DRINKING UNDERAGE. ALRIGHT. I, IT WAS A BLACK, MY WIFE, SHE WASN'T ABLE TO MAKE TONIGHT, BUT SHE WAS WITH ME AT THE TIME THAT OKAY. THEY WOULD THIS AND THEN THE GENTLEMAN NAMED LOUIE, UH, MCBRIDE, WHO SIGNED THAT, IT'S RIGHT THERE AT HIS HOUSE AS WELL ON THE, HE'S ON THE CORNER WHERE THIS TOOK PLACE. I, UM, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO CLARIFY ONE POINT, UM, AS, UH, PLAN COMMISSION, Y'ALL ARE ABLE TO ADD ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS TO THIS, UH, PERMIT, BUT, UH, AS OUR ATTORNEY POINTED OUT, JUST NOT FOR THE PAYMENT OF THE MAINTENANCE OF THE ROAD. SO JUST WANNA BE, WANT Y'ALL TO BE AWARE OF THAT AS Y'ALL DELIBERATE. SO, EXCUSE ME. THANK YOU. DO YOU, DO WE KNOW THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF HOUSES THAT ARE ON, ON THAT ROAD? SORRY. NO, YOU WERE UP . UH, THERE ARE 39 LOTS, UH, INCLUDING THE SUBJECT PROPERTY AND 32, UM, HOUSES. 32 HOUSES. OKAY. THAT'S IN THE WHOLE SUBDIVISION. UH, THAT'S THE, YEAH, THE SUB PROPERTY, THE SUBDIVISION, AND THE TWO LOTS, UH, BEFORE THE SUBDIVISION THAT ARE ALSO ON FLEMING ROAD. SO EVERYBODY THAT USES FLEMING ROAD THAT YOU, THEY WILL USE FLEMING ROAD? YES. OKAY. THANK YOU. CAN WE TALK AMONGST YOURSELVES? YES, SURE. YES, PLEASE. I MEAN, I'M, YES. SO THERE'S 12, 13 SIGNATURES, SOMETHING LIKE THAT OUT OF 35. I MEAN, I MEAN, I AM AN ADVOCATE FOR PROPERTY RIGHTS. I, I, I WONDER, THIS ISN'T A DECLARATION OR ANYTHING. IT'S JUST A THOUGHT. I MEAN, LIMIT IT. LIMIT HOW MANY GUESTS PER YEAR, UM, AND NOT DO A FIVE YEAR TERM. SHORTEN IT DOWN. AND IF THIS BAD BEHAVIOR CONTINUES, THEN WE HAVE THE RIGHT TO REVIEW IT IN A YEAR OR HOWEVER LONG. IS THAT AN OPTION? MM-HMM . A SHORTER TERM. MM-HMM . THE PLANNING CONDITION. I'M SORRY, THE PLANNING COMMISSION YES. CAN MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS AS TO CONDITIONS AND SEND THAT UP TO THE BOARD OF [00:35:01] SUPERVISORS WITH EITHER YOUR RECOMMENDATION FOR APPROVAL OR YOUR RECOMMENDATION FOR DENIAL. I, I LIKE THAT SUGGESTION. I THINK THAT'S A, THAT'S A, AND THAT, AND THAT GIVES THE HOMEOWNER AN OPPORTUNITY TO USE HIS PROPERTY AS HE SEES FIT AND ALSO AN OPPORTUNITY TO CLEAN UP HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH HIS NEIGHBORS. YES. SO, MM-HMM . IS, IS A YEAR WITHIN REASON, REASON I WOULD SUPPORT A YEAR. MAY I SPEAK AGAIN? UM, ABOUT TWO. CAN THE APPLICANT SPEAK THE NEIGHBORHOOD? IF ONE OF THE MEMBERS OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FROM, UH, SOMEONE WHO HAS SPOKEN BASED AND YOU HAVE A QUESTION FOR SOMEONE WHO HAS SPOKEN AND GIVEN YOU INFORMATION, YOU CAN CERTAINLY CALL THEM BACK UP TO THE PODIUM TO ANSWER A QUESTION FOR YOU. I DON'T HAVE A QUESTION. I DON'T A SPECIFIC QUESTION, SO I DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. DO YOU, UH, QUESTION IF IT'S THE, UH, FOUR BY FOURS THAT THE ISSUE, COULD A RESTRICTION BE ADDED THAT NO UNLICENSED VEHICLES WILL BE TAKEN OFF THE PROPERTY? OR MAYBE EVEN RESTRICT IT TO NO UNLICENSED VEHICLES WILL BE PERMITTED TO BE BROUGHT ONTO THE PROPERTY. MM-HMM . YEP. MOTORIZED, I MEAN, BICYCLES, SOMEBODY VACATIONING, MAYBE ONE BRINGS BIKES TO THE MOTORIZED. MOTORIZED. MOTORIZED. YEAH. MIGHT HAVE TO TIGHTEN THAT UP. OKAY. UH, DO WE HAVE ANY THOUGHTS ON, UM, RE ANY RESTRICTIONS ON, UM, HOW MANY TIMES PER MONTH, UH, IT CAN BE RENTED OR UP TO 10 DAYS PER MONTH OR UP TO FIVE DAYS? IS THAT, I THINK IF WE LIMIT THE, THE, THE AMOUNT OF THE TP, WE'LL FIGURE THAT OUT. LIKE COMMENTS FROM THE NEIGHBORS, ET CETERA. I MEAN, IF THEY'RE GONNA FORMALLY COMPLAIN, WE'LL WE'LL KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING. LIKE 10, 10 STAYS A YEAR. IS THAT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT? WELL, I MEAN, HYPOTHETICAL NUMBER MM-HMM . YEAH. YEAH. MM-HMM . 10 RENTALS A YEAR IS THE HYPOTHETICAL NUMBER. YEAH. I JUST WANTED TO GET SOME CLARITY. UH, 'CAUSE WE'RE GONNA BE, IF, IF YOU ALL ARE GONNA BE MAKING A MOTION, WE WANNA MAKE SURE, UH, THAT IT REFLECTS WHAT YOU ALL WANT. SO I'M HEARING THAT, UM, YOU'RE GOING TO BE RECOMMENDING AN EXPIRATION DATE, UH, OF, INSTEAD OF FIVE YEARS, IT WOULD BE A ONE YEAR, UM, EXPIRATION DATE. UM, AND THEN I HEARD SOME ABOUT LIMITING SOME THE, PERHAPS FOUR WHEELERS OR DIRT BIKES. UH, WE HAVE DONE THAT IN A, IN A DIFFERENT CONDITION. I DIDN'T KNOW IF SPECIFICALLY WHAT YOU ALL WANTED TO, UM, IF YOU ALL WANTED TO PURSUE THAT ROUTE, I DIDN'T KNOW SPECIFICALLY WHAT YOU WANT TO DO. CAN WE DO THAT AS AN AMENDMENT IN THE, IN THE APPROVAL? YOU CAN MAKE THAT AS A REC, YOU CAN AMEND, UM, TO ADD THOSE TWO CONDITIONS TO AMEND THE ONE CONDITION ON EXPIRATION AND ADD ONE. YEP. UM, AND AGAIN, THE BOARD WOULD THEN TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION AND THE, I GUESS THE WORDING THAT I HEARD WAS NO UNLICENSED MOTORIZED VEHICLES, UH, PERMITTED ON THE PROPERTY. MM-HMM . YEP. I AM HEARING DISCUSSION OR, UH, LI DISCUSSION ABOUT LIMITING THE NUMBER OF TIMES IT, NOT JUST THAT IT COULD BE RENTED FOR A YEAR, SHORT TERM RENTAL, BUT ONLY 10 TIMES WITHIN THAT YEAR. RIGHT. UM, I GUESS I'D, I'D LIKE TO ASK THE APPLICANT, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT HE WOULD BE WILLING TO, UH, LIMIT IT TO OR DOES THAT SOME CREATE AN HARDSHIP ON HIM SO THEY'LL BE FINE? YES, SIR. 10, 10 TIMES A YEAR. 10 RENTALS. SO THAT'S NOT, IF COULD 12, MAYBE ONCE A MONTH I'LL BE HAPPIER. BUT THEN IT'S FINE AS WELL. YES, SIR. OKAY. DO YOU ALSO STORE EQUIPMENT THERE? I HEARD, UH, SOME THERE WAS MAYBE HEAVY EQUIPMENT, SO, OR EQUIPMENT STORAGE IN THE, IN THE BEGINNING WE HAVE HAVE MORE EQUIPMENT BECAUSE TO CLEAN THE LAND. OKAY. NOW ONLY HAVE A TRACTOR TO CUT THE GRASS. OKAY. SO THERE'S NOT HEAVY EQUIPMENT STORED THAT'S GOING UP AND DOWN LEMON ROAD IN, IN AND OUT ON A REGULAR BASIS? NO, SIR. OKAY. SO THAT'S, THAT'S, SO WE COULD ALSO MAYBE SAY NO HEAVY EQUIPMENT. WELL, I THINK THAT'S, WELL NOW THAT'S PROBABLY NOT EVEN PERMITTED WITHOUT A PERMIT. IF HE'S THERE, HE CAN USE THAT YES. AS HIS PROPERTY. YES, HE COULD, YEAH. CAN USE IT ON HIS OWN PROPERTY, BUT IT CAN'T BE, UH, BUSINESS EQUIPMENT STORED THERE COMING IN AND OUT ALL THE TIME. SO THAT'S, THAT'S NOT PERMITTED IN THE COUNTY ANYWAY WITHOUT A CUP. SO IF WE'RE GONNA LIMIT IT, WHY DON'T WE GIVE THEM 12 A YEAR, ONE A MONTH WITH ONE YEAR? YEAH, I WOULD BE OKAY WITH THAT. OKAY. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING UP. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. UM, AND I WOULD, UH, JUST A COMMENT IN GENERAL, IF THERE ARE COMPLAINTS, YOU KNOW, MAYBE NOT CALL YOUR NEIGHBOR BUT ACTUALLY CALL THE COUNTY AND SAY, HEY, I AM COMPLAINING SO THAT WE, YOU KNOW, GET A PUBLIC RECORD. WE'RE [00:40:01] LOOKING AT IT AND SAYING THERE'S NO COMPLAINTS. SO MAYBE JUST A RECOMMENDATION TO DO THAT AS WELL. MY THING IS THAT HE CAN ALL RIGHT. COME, CAN YOU, CAN YOU COME UP AND AND ANSWER A QUESTION FOR ME? I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW, UM, THESE INCIDENTS, HAS THERE BEEN, UH, HAS THE COUNTY LAW ENFORCEMENT BEEN CALLED ON ANY OF THESE THAT YOU KNOW OF? NO, BECAUSE HERE'S WHAT I, I HAVE CALLED ONCE, AND HERE'S WHAT THEY TOLD ME. THEY SAID THAT THE ONLY THING THAT THE POLICE COULD DO, BECAUSE IT IS A PRIVATE ROAD, IT'S NOT STATE MAINTAINED, IS I WOULD HAVE TO GET THE LICENSE PLATE, GET THE PERSON'S PICTURE DRIVING THE CAR. I WOULD'VE TO GO TO THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, I WOULD HAVE TO FILE A, UM, RECKLESS DRIVING AND GO THROUGH ALL THAT TO GET IT DONE. WHICH IS, AND YOU KNOW, WITH, WITH THAT BEING SAID, IT'S A WASTE OF MY TIME TO DO SO. AND, AND THERE ARE OTHER BAD BEHAVIORS. FOR EXAMPLE, UNDERAGE DRINKING. YOU COULD HAVE CALLED THAT IN, I SUSPECT. AND PROBABLY IF THERE'S EXCESSIVE NOISE, THERE'S NOISE COMPLAINTS, UH, THAT YOU, YOU COULD CALL THAT IN. YEAH, I COULD HAVE CALLED IT IN. BUT BY THE TIME THE POLICE GOT DOWN THERE, I MEAN, I UNDERSTAND, BUT THEN THERE WOULD BE A RECORD FOR US. WELL, WHEN WE REVIEW IT NEXT YEAR, YOU'RE SAYING GIVE HIM THIS, THIS, AND THIS. OKAY. THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR FIVE YEARS NOW. MM-HMM . HE CAN NOT, AND HE SAID, HE STATED HE CANNOT CONTROL OTHER VEHICLES. SO, ALRIGHT, SO I'M GONNA RENT IT OUT TO YOU FOR A MONTH OR A WEEK WEEKEND. YOU GONNA BRING FOUR WHEEL US DOWN. HE DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT. THEY'RE RIDING. WELL, WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO? I'VE CONTACTED HIM PRIOR ON VEHICLES COMING FROM THERE, THE OWNER AND NOTHING'S BEEN DONE. AND AS FAR AS EQUIPMENT, THEY GOT LAWN EQUIPMENT AND STUFF DOWN THERE THAT THEY BRING IN AND OUT ON A TRAILER WITH A TRUCK. OKAY. OKAY. WITH HIS COMPANY VINCENT. UH, RIGHT. WHATEVER. RIGHT. WHAT I'M SAYING IS GIVING HIM A CHANCE. IT'S, IT, I I'M GONNA BE IN HERE MORE THAN Y'ALL ARE I MEAN, FOR REAL. I MEAN THIS IS A PRIVATE COMMUNITY. IT IS A PRIVATE ROAD. WE DON'T NEED THIS. AND, AND BEING THE, THE FIVE YEARS OR THE ONE YEAR THAT YOU'RE GONNA ALLOW THIS TO HAPPEN, THAT'S ANOTHER WHOLE YEAR THAT HERE WE ARE GOING TO HAVE, KEEP THE ROAD UP. IT'S HARD WITH $300 A PERSON AND NOT EVERYBODY PAYING THEIR DUES TO BEGIN WITH. IT'S HARD TO KEEP THE HOLES OUTTA THE ROAD. OKAY. AND LIKE I SAID, YOU KNOW, YOU SAY I'VE ONLY GOT X AMOUNT OF PEOPLE. THAT'S BECAUSE IT'S HARD TO CATCH PEOPLE ON A SATURDAY. AND ANOTHER REASON IS, IS BECAUSE I'M NOT GONNA BOTHER SOMEBODY DURING THE WEEK. AND THE THIRD REASON IS I'M SKEPTICAL ABOUT GOING TO ANYBODY'S DOOR AND KNOCKING ON IT NOT GETTING SHOT NOWADAYS. OKAY. SO, YOU KNOW, THE THE FOOT 14 I GOT WAS THE ONES I FELT COMFORTABLE GOING TO THE DOORS. ALRIGHT, THANK YOU. SO I DON'T, UH, YOU KNOW, LIKE I SAID, IF, IF HE CAN'T CONTROL THE FOUR WHEELERS, HE DON'T KNOW THEY'RE THERE. HE'S NOT THERE. HE DON'T KNOW IF YOU BRING A FOUR WHEELER IN OR NOT. SO IF IT'S A CONDITION AND IT'S NOT ALLOWED AND YOU EVEN HEAR A FOUR WHEELER, YOU KNOW, CALL, CALL, CALL THE COUNTY, IT'S EASY. AND WE, WE CAN CATCH THEM NO PROBLEM. AND THEN IT'S A FORMAL COMPLAINT AND WE CAN SEE IT. YEAH. ALRIGHT. BUT WE KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING BEFORE, SO WHY EVEN DISCUSS? 'CAUSE IT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S GONNA HAPPEN GOING FORWARD. OKAY. NOW WE CONDITION. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ESPECIALLY IF IT, IF IT'S REQUIRED ON HIS LEASE AGREEMENT. SO, OKAY. WHAT ABOUT THE CAR SPEEDING UP THE ROAD THERE? WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO ABOUT THE SPEED? OKAY, THANK YOU. ANY MORE DISCUSSION AS ANY ALRIGHT, UH, MAKE, I'M SORRY. WELL, UH, JUST FOR CLARITY, THESE ARE THE AMENDMENTS THAT I AM HEARING THERE. AN AMENDMENT TO NUMBER CONDITION NUMBER 10, UH, CURRENTLY READS EXPIRATION. THIS CUP EXPIRES THE LAST DAY OF JANUARY 31. I'M HEARING, UH, THAT YOU ALL WOULD LIKE TO CHANGE THAT EXPIRATION DATE TO JANUARY, 2027. THAT IS ONE YEAR FROM WHEN THIS WOULD BE SCHEDULED TO GO TO THE BOARD. YES. YES. OKAY. SO THAT IS ONE, UM, A RECOMMENDATION, UM, FOR YOUR UNLICENSED 26TH. THAT'S JUST THIS MONTH. 27TH. 25 WOULD BE 27TH. 2027. EXCUSE ME. UM, SO A RECOMMENDATION FOR WHAT YOU ALL SAYING THE WORDING BEING GUESTS SHALL NOT OPERATE UNLICENSED MOTOR VEHICLES ON THE PROPERTY. ALRIGHT. I WOULD SAY THAT THEY DON'T COME ON THE PROPERTY PERIOD, OPERATING OR NOT, THEY JUST, THEY'RE NOT PERMITTED OR NOT ALLOWED ON THE PROPERTY. MM-HMM . CORRECT? UH, GUESTS, GUESTS SHALL NOT BRING UN UNLICENSED VEHICLES ONTO THE PROPERTY. THEY SHALL NOT MOTOR VEHICLE BRING OR OPERATE. I THINK, YOU KNOW, HE IS THROW BOTH IN, RIGHT? I GUESS YOU SHOULDN'T BRING ON BOTH. YEAH. I GUESS WHAT I DON'T WANNA STOP HIM FROM DOING IS DRIVING HIS OWN TRACTOR. SO, SO GUESTS, GUESTS CANNOT. SO FOR, FOR CLARITY, UM, WHEN THESE CONDITIONS ARE IMPOSED, IT ONLY IS FOR THE CUP ACTIVITY. SO THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO USE THEIR PROPERTY, UM, AS THEY WOULD AS A NON GUEST OF THE AIRBNB. ALL RIGHT? SO GUESTS SHALL [00:45:01] NOT BRING OR OPERATE UNLICENSED MOTOR VEHICLES, HUH? TO THE PROPERTY. MM-HMM . ON THE PROPERTY. OKAY. AND I DID HEAR SOME DISCUSSION ABOUT LIMITING, UM, DAYS OR, OR BOOKINGS AND JUST YOU, YOU HAD MENTIONED 12. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S 12. UM, HE SAID THAT'S WHAT HE THINKS HE DOES. I I, I'M WILLING TO, I'M WILLING TO DO 12, SO 12 BOOKINGS PER YEAR. PER YEAR. AND SO THAT WOULD BE, THE CURRENT TIME WAS 11 O'CLOCK AS WELL. IS THERE ANY SUPPORT WITH LOWERING THAT TO 10 O'CLOCK SINCE WE ARE ON A PRIVATE ROAD IN A VERY RESIDENTIAL AREA? ALEX, IT'S FOUR 10. IT IS 10 O'CLOCK. I BELIEVE IT IS 10. OH, I THOUGHT IT SAID 11. I THOUGHT IT SAID 11. OH, IT IS 11. YEAH. YEAH. SO THAT IS UNDER, UM, NUMBER FIVE. OKAY. LET'S SOUND AND MUSIC B, THERE SHALL BE NO OUTDOOR MUSIC AFTER 11 O'CLOCK. 10 10, 10 O'CLOCK IS THE, UM, GOOD CALL. OKAY. OKAY. AND THAT WOULD BE CONDITION FIVE. OKAY. OKAY. SO WHAT I'M HEARING, AND AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE GONNA REPEAT THIS, LIKE WHAT SHE SAID MADE EMOTIONALLY LIKE WHAT SHE SAID, BUT WHAT I'M HEARING IS ON CONDITION NUMBER FIVE B, THERE SHALL BE NO OUTDOOR MUSIC INSTEAD OF 11:00 PM THAT IS BEING RECOMMENDED AS A CHANGE TO 10:00 PM ON CONDITION NUMBER 10 EXPIRATION. THE CUP EXPIRES THE LAST DAY OF JANUARY 31 IS HOW IT CURRENTLY READS. THE, UH, RECOMMENDED AMENDMENT IS TO JANUARY 27. ANY APPLICATION FOR RENEWAL SHOULD BE FILED BEFORE THE EXPIRATION DATE I'M HEARING. UM, AND THIS IS, UH, VERBATIM OF WHAT WE DISCUSSED BEFORE. UM, AND A NEW CONDITION, WHICH I GUESS WOULD BE NUMBER 12, UH, SHALL GUESTS SHALL NOT BRING OR OPERATE UNLICENSED MOTOR VEHICLES ON THE PROPERTY. AND THAT, HMM. SO FOR 13, UM, THE, UM, SHORT TERM RENTAL UNHOSTED SHALL NOT, UH, EXCEED 12 TIMES 12 RESERVATIONS OR BOOKINGS PER YEAR. MM-HMM . YEAH. WHAT DID YOU SAY, MR. SURE. PER YEAR? YEAH, PER YEAR. UH, MADAM COUNSEL, WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ON, ON THESE? IS THERE ANY CLARIFICATION THAT NEEDS TO BE MADE? I THINK AT THIS POINT, NO. THEY JUST NEEDED TO BE, THEY NEED TO BE INCLUDED IN THE MOTION. OKAY. IF, IF THERE IS A MOTION FOR, UH, A MOTION TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL MM-HMM . WITH THOSE CHANGED CONDITIONS, IF THERE'S A MOTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL, THOSE DO NOT NEED TO BE INCLUDED. UNLESS, UNLESS THE PLANNING COMMISSION WISHES TO MAKE A MOTION TO RECOMMEND STATING THAT IT WOULD APPROVE IT, MAKE A MOTION TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL IF, WHICH IS THE MOST COMPLICATED WAY TO DO IT. SO WE COULD DENY IT AND RECOMMENDING APPROVAL AT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS LEVEL. IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SUGGESTING NOW? THAT WOULD BE OKAY. NEVERMIND. YOU SAID THAT'S THE WORST, THAT'S THE WORST WAY TO DO IT. IT'S THE MOST CONFUSING WAY TO DO IT. LET'S NOT DO THAT. LET'S NOT DO THAT THEN. BUT, BUT SOMETIMES, SOMETIMES IT GETS ACROSS THE EXACT MESS MESSAGE THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION WISHES I GET AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S TRUE HERE, MR. KIMBERLY. OKAY. THANK YOU. READY? MM-HMM . READY? ALRIGHT. I MOVE THAT THE COMMISSION RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THIS CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT TO, UH, CU 2 0 2 5 0 0 0 7 APPLICATION BY ROGEL AND MARTA BENSON, UH, SUBJECT TO THE IMPOSED CONDITIONS AS PRESENTED WITH THE AMENDMENTS, UH, AS STATED BY MS. SHERRY. WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO READ THOSE FOR THE RECORD PLEASE? YES. YES. OKAY. LET'S READ THEM INTO THE RECORD. CONDITION NUMBER FIVE IS AMENDED TO CONDITION NUMBER FIVE B IS COMMEND, UH, AMENDED TO SAY THERE SHALL BE NO OUTDOOR MUSIC AFTER 10:00 PM CONDITION NUMBER 10 IS AMENDED TO EXPIRATION. THIS CUP EXPIRES THE LAST DAY OF JANUARY, 2027. ANY APPLICATION FOR A RENEWAL SHOULD BE FILED BEFORE THE EXPIRATION DATE. THIS IS AN ADDITION. UH, ADDITIONAL CONTIN, UM, CONDITION NUMBER 12, GUESTS SHALL NOT BRING OR OPERATE UNLICENSED MOTOR VEHICLES ON THE PROPERTY. UM, AND THEN NUMBER 13, UH, THE SHORT TERM RENTAL UNHOSTED SHALL NOT BE RESERVED MORE THAN 12 [00:50:01] TIMES PER YEAR. OH, I THINK WE HAVE ANOTHER, UH, RECOMMENDATION FROM ANOTHER. WHICH ONES THIS 10,000 POUNDS. WE, WE WILL LOOK INTO THAT AND CLARIFY THAT BETWEEN BOARD AND THE OTHER. I THINK THE WAY IT READS NOW, I THINK IT MEETS YOUR INTENT. IT DOES. YEAH. I DON'T WANT TO LIMIT. UM, SO THE SHORT TERM RENTAL UNHOSTED SHALL NOT BE RENTED MORE THAN 12 TIMES PER YEAR. IS THERE CLARITY THAT MEANS THAT NOT 12 DAYS? 'CAUSE SOMETIMES THEY BOOK A WEEKEND. SO 12 INDIVIDUAL BOOKINGS AS YOU, AS YOU STATED IT. YES. 12 PER INDIVIDUAL BOOK BOOKINGS IN THIS YEAR. INDIVIDUAL BOOKINGS. SO LET ME READ THAT AGAIN. THE SHORT TERM RENTAL UNHOSTED SHALL NOT EXCEED 12 RESIDENTIAL BOOKINGS RENTALS. RENTALS PER YEAR. OKAY. DOES THAT WORK, MS. BALDING? IT DOES. THANK YOU. I SECOND MR. LEYS MOSTON. UH, MS. PARKER, CAN WE HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? YES, MA'AM. MR. DEAN? AYE. MR. MCLAUGHLIN AYE. MS. KOWALSKI AYE. MR. PATT AYE. MR. KIMBERLY AYE, THE MOTION TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL AS AMENDED PASSES ON A FIVE OH VOTE. THIS CASE IS TENTATIVELY SCHEDULED TO BE HEARD BY THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS ON JANUARY 6TH, 2026. IT MOVES FORWARD WITH A RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL AS AMENDED FROM THE PLANNING COMMISSION. IF THERE [11. Adjournment] IS NO OTHER BUSINESS, THIS MEETING IS ADJOURNED. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.